And while he says his family's businesses legitimately qualified for government contracts why then did they send in hundreds of invoices for less than ten thousand dollars? It's a pattern observed over many years, and it is meant to deliberately avoid oversight and red tape from the Ministry of Finance. We asked him about those structured payments:
Courtney Menzies:
"Why were hundreds of the payments structured in a way to ensure that it's below $10,000? Did you not find this suspicious?"
Oscar Mira, Minister of Home Affairs
"I have nothing to do with how government pays their contractors or their suppliers. I have nothing as a minister to do with how the Ministry of Finance pays. That is not my decision. I don't know, and I don't think it's also the decision of any supplier to ask how to be paid. I really do not believe it is that way. It is, as I have understood it now, a part of how payments are done. I really do not know. As ministers, I don't go into the finance office or any way trying to influence how or who gets paid. That's not my job."
Courtney Menzies:
"Now that all this information has come to light, the optics look bad whether or not you had a hand in it. Will you do anything to rectify it?"
Oscar Mira, Minister of Home Affairs
"I think it's a public perception that, yes. And I really don't see the reason why those payments were made that way. If you go through the process, if you go through the procurement process, if you get your, you know, pay for your tender package, you go through the whole long process of all the paperwork that's included, because I have been asking, and you are awarded the contract, then, Yes, I think that, you know, you should be paid for the services that you have given and, is there a better way? I believe there is. I don't think there is any supplier who would want to be paid in so many small pieces. 'm sure that as a supplier, you would want to be paid fully. So that has nothing to do to do with with me as the minister of state or as a minister Now at the Ministry of Home Affairs. I believe that it's probably something that, you know, every crisis, you know, you learn from them. And I myself, of course, I'm trying to make sure that I learn from this. And the government has their procedures and they should be followed. I have no issue in having anyone but I, as a minister or as a minister of state, I really don't have a say in the procurement minister."
Courtney Menzies:
"Are you not concerned, though, that because these structured payments in the financial world is called smurfing and it's a form of money laundering, are you not concerned that your former ministry can be accused of money laundering?"
Oscar Mira, Minister of Home Affairs
"Of course, there's that concern. I don't think that any one wouldn't be concerned. But was anything illegally done? I don't know. I didn't know they call it Smurfing because I really do not go there asking or being part of the finance officer or whatever to do that. That wasn't my job."
